Jet2k5 Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 I'm going to build a computer by the end of this summer ( hopefully ) I was wondering what are some of the advantages of 64-bit and some of the dissadvantages. Also when you are buying them what options to look for. Seems like there is really not that much software for a 64-bit processor. Only 1 real good distro like Fedora. Everything else just seems to suck and lag behind. So I want to know is it really worth buying? How does it perform with popular apps like firefox, Linux in general etc etc.. games too btw. [moved from Other Linux Distributions by spinynorman] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devries Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 I've upgraded to an AMD64 3200 recently but I'm still running in 32-bit mode. Like you say: the number of packages (still no flash and you need that if you like web games) is too small. Mandriva is supposed to make it very easy to run 64 en 32 bit apps next to each other but I decided not to bother. I used my last PC for 5 years so I guess I will make the switch sometime in the nex couple of years :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonMage Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 The good news is: an x86_64 distro in an Athlon 64 could have an effect of 10-20% increase depending on applications. The bad news are drivers and plugins. No 64 bit Flash plugins for Linux yet for example. Since you will be buying it at the end of the summer, you may as well buy a 64 bit computer. The price difference is quite negiligible. Besides, you can always use a 32 bit distro if you find 64 bit distro lacking. My A64 is still running fine with 32 bit Mandriva 2005 LE. Note that if you buy a P4-64 bit, installing a 64 bit distro will barely have any effect at all. In fact, it may even be worse. It's something in the way Intel put 64 bit that disagree with the Linux kernel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Adriano1 Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 Weren't they supposed to be compatible with the Athlon 64 specs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonMage Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 Compatible maybe, but definitely not the same. You probably know that Intel tacked on the EMT64 (the Intel Implementation) instead of building it from the base like AMD A64. Plus the fact that the EMT64 only means the ability to access 64 bit memory addressing so it can access more than 4 GB of memory. AMD's x86_64 has a few more additions to that, I think. One of them has something to do with IOMMU (IO Memory Mapping Unit?, not sure what it is). AMD has it, Intel doesn't. Linux kernel does support it, so 64 bit apps will be better in A64 compared to P4-64. As proof, here is a link from Anandtech about how 64 bit apps actually makes it worse in P4 compared to quite a bit of improvement in A64 http://www.anandtech.com/IT/showdoc.aspx?i=2447&p=5 Look at the first chart. Anyway, I played around with the 1 CD iso version of MDV 2005 LE x86_64. It does feel a bit snappier. However, since it doesn't have wvdial, I cannot connect to the internet, so it's useless for me. I just finished downloading the DVD version of FC4 x86_64 last night. I plan to play around with it tonight. Wish me luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lowe Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 All 64 bit distro's i've tried don't seem any faster on my computer (amd64 3200) so i'm still using 32bit distro's mainly for the packages and because i notice no speed gain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonMage Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 Probably because it's already fast to begin with. I think with Linux desktop, once you get over 1 GHz, you will barely feel any faster. I barely feel any difference between my old Athlon XP 1700+ and my current A64 3000+ in regular applications. FC4 is a bit lacking at the moment for me. Still cannot find an easy way to get codecs. I think I am going to reinstall my Mandrake 2005 LE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlc Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 (edited) I run 64bit fc4 on my 3200, and I love it :) With Fedora, has multilib so you can just install a 32bit browser for plugins. Not sure about mdk, but suse and gentoo both use multilib too. Edited June 27, 2005 by cybrjackle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonMage Posted June 27, 2005 Report Share Posted June 27, 2005 Now that Suse downloadable ISO is out, I think I am going to download the DVD (4.2 gigs.. that'll take, 2 weeks) and try it out. The 1 disk iso for MDV 2005LE definitely doesn't have multilib. It just doesn't have the space for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet2k5 Posted June 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 Thanks for the post. I want a distro though that takes FULL Advantage of the 64-bit processor. But still allows me to run applications that are 32-bit. I hear a lot of people complain about 64-bit codecs, but I could use the 32-bit normally that would be good too. I was wondering how come Firefox doesn't have a 64-bit version? I mean I thought when you compile a program under 64-bit you just need to re-compile the program and not change ( usually ) any part of the code. I'm most likely going with a 64-bit 3000+, 1gb RAM, Nvidia 6800 256mb PCI x16, 80 GB hdd ( maybe upgrade to 160) , and a CRT. I have to room for one, and I will get an LCD when I have more money and I learn about them. For now I will just stick to CRT. They are good and cheap. So what is _is_ the best distro. Right now I have Ubuntu ready to test out and everything. Should I get fedora, even gentoo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonMage Posted June 28, 2005 Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 (edited) Recompiling is not as easy as snapping your finger. Not only the code needs to be 64 bit compatible, but the supporting libraries also need to be 64 bit. An example for this is OpenOffice.org 1.1.x. It cannot be recompiled to 64 bit without a lot of hacks. Good thing that OO.o 2.0 should be available in 64 bit version. Anyway, MDV 2005 x86_64 uses 64 bit version of Firefox. Of course, I heard that you need 32 bit version of Firefox in order to use plugins such as Flash (no 64 bit available). I will check what version of Firefox that is available in FC4 x86_64, but I will be surprised if it is not 64 bit version too. Edited June 28, 2005 by DragonMage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet2k5 Posted June 28, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 Ok thanks DragonMage. That is good to hear. I however am looking for a n00b distro. I seriously don't want to mess around with configuring. So I'm worth giving mdk a try for a couple more years. Now that the hardware that it is going on is better and more recent everything should work perfect. Is the version of x82_x64 free? Or do I have to pay money for it? Either way it seems good. Fedora and Mandriva seem to be the best choices right now. I'll also be testing out ubuntu. So I'm going to be having a total of 3 distros running for a while seeing which one runs better :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DragonMage Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 I just checked and FC4 definitely has 64 bit version of Firefox. Anyway, the x86_64 version of Mandriva, Ubuntu, and FC are free. Suse's downloadable DVD is out just a couple of days ago, it supposed to include the x86_64 version in the same DVD. If you want a noob version, I suggest you use either Ubuntu or Mandriva. To tell you the truth, I haven't tried Ubuntu ever since the free givaway days, since I found it very lacking (no kernel source for compiling NVidia kernel, for example). And I also find that the one disk iso for Mandriva x86_64 is lacking too. If you have broadband, you can install one from those one disk and pull the rest via the internet. I don't have broadband and neither distro provides wvdial so I cannot connect to the Internet. So those two are out for me. However, since you live in the USA, you can order the DVD x86_64 version of Mandriva for about 10 dollars plus shipping and handling from a place like cheapbytes. I think you will find the experience a lot better than I did. BTW, I tried toughening out on FC4 x86_64. It's definitely not a noobie distro. What I took for granted in Mandriva (built in mp3 support, ntfs support, centralized management console, etc) are not found in FC4. Good thing that the modem dialer in FC4 is wvdial based so that I can pull what I need from the Internet. Right now I am relearning /etc/fstab file since it seems that FC4 doesn't allow write access to vfat partition for regular users. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iphitus Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 What about one of these? http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/Produc...5_13041,00.html :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet2k5 Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 yeah I was thinking about the kernel source in ubuntu. They don't provide one, but the nvidia drivers work out of the box, but it's the ones that they have on the repos, not the newest one. Right now Mandrake is the best choice for me, and KDE. Since I feel that gnome is good for my laptop since it's small. But since I'm getting a bigger computer I want something lets just say " Bloated " with more stuff :) Anyhow why would i need to buy the DVD version when I have Broadband? Wouldn't downloading it and burning it be the same thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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