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pbpersson

My main concern with open source

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It greatly worries me that if Microsoft sees a feature in Linux that they would like to incorporate into Windows, the source code is at their disposal. All the innovation in Linux is a open book for anyone else to copy.

 

The same is true of applications in Linux. People have said that if we had some killer applications that ran in Linux more people would want to switch to the OS. However, if these applications are licensed under the GPL then any commercial company can easily write the same application for Windows.

 

How can Linux and Linux applications ever hope to be unique in the world if all the secrets are public knowledge?

 

 

Phil

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How can Linux and Linux applications ever hope to be unique in the world if all the secrets are public knowledge?

it can't

 

it should concern you, if you concern yourself with that sorta thing....

Security and stability is what sells anyone on linux...

...once an OS is developed that has those qualities and ease of use, linux will remain the back door, and I think we will see that in the near future. It may even be unix based, I don't know. I do know that M$ has made no secret of the fact that it's top priority right now is learning from the best....Linux B)

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if microsoft wants to use linux-components, then let them. as long as they adhere to the gpl, i have no problem with it. this could finally make windows more transparent and thus reliable which would be a good thing imho. not because they always run campaigns in order to protect their monopoly and because it will strenghten their position, but because users will benefit from it. and if users get a similar technology for 300 $ (microsoft) or for 0 $ (linux), then microsoft will be forced on the long haul to reduce the price for their apps. and it could mean that linux and windows will become more compatible, that there might be more hardware and software supported in linux, that there will be less frustration for home and business users alike.

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if microsoft wants to use linux-components, then let them. as long as they adhere to the gpl, i have no problem with it.

 

Microsoft will see how it is done, incorporate the logic into Windows, and say they invented it. Heck, Longhorn could be Linux in the inside and we would never know it! :angry:

 

In the meantime, they would say that it was much, much better than Linux and would modify it so only Windows programs could be run on it.

 

 

 

Phil

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Microsoft will see how it is done, incorporate the logic into Windows, and say they invented it.  Heck, Longhorn could be Linux in the inside and we would never know it!

 

There are several avenues of attack against this kind of thing. One of the most robust is the replication of defects in the original code. Imagine two students on an exam - if they get identical, correct answers, that shows nothing. But if they make identical mistakes, you will probably assume cheating.

 

If the logic is flawed (and not just the execution) then even translation of the code to a description and back again won't fix it.

 

The question then becomes a more practical one. Even if you have proof of this happening, are you going to go up against Microsoft's Scary Lawyers :tm: , and not take the out-of-court take-the-cash-and-shut-up money?

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yeah, I've been just waiting for MS to come out with a new version of IE with Tabbed Browsing, and all sorts of great new features - that firefox has had forever... and then act like they invented it...

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if microsoft wants to use linux-components, then let them. as long as they adhere to the gpl, i have no problem with it.

 

Microsoft will see how it is done, incorporate the logic into Windows, and say they invented it. Heck, Longhorn could be Linux in the inside and we would never know it! :angry:

 

In the meantime, they would say that it was much, much better than Linux and would modify it so only Windows programs could be run on it.

 

 

 

Phil

 

It could easily be discovered that it contains GPL'ed code and, if it does, then everything tied to it automatically becomes GPL...a bad day for Microsoft and certainly not a risk they would be willing to take, I don't think.

 

These requirements apply to the modified work as a whole.  If

identifiable sections of that work are not derived from the Program,

and can be reasonably considered independent and separate works in

themselves, then this License, and its terms, do not apply to those

sections when you distribute them as separate works.  But when you

distribute the same sections as part of a whole which is a work based

on the Program, the distribution of the whole must be on the terms of

this License, whose permissions for other licensees extend to the

entire whole, and thus to each and every part regardless of who wrote it.

 

Ex: MS incoroprates GPL code to give IE tabbed browsing. IE is now GPL, unless of course the tabbed browsing feature is distributed as a plugin or separate extension.

 

Now, let's say they take Fluxbox's mousewheel desktop scrolling to incorporate multiple desktops into WindowsXP, guess what? Windows XP is now GPL since you can not reasonably separate Windows itself from Windows Explorer.

 

But IANAL.

Edited by Steve Scrimpshire

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But what is to stop them taking the concept of tabbed bowsing, building their own code to implement it and then patenting tabbed browsing?

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patent applications should prove that there has been no prior art regarding the invention.

 

these concerns are one reason people should license their code in the GPL and not the BSD license... GPL means that it will remain free.

 

but of course, BSD license is still useful for lots of other stuff, M$ already uses code licensed under BSD, as well as Apple and other companies

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It's a chess game. Everybody knows how the pieces all move. Everybody uses the same names for the pieces. Yet, how the pieces are moved makes some better players than others. So open source has no secrets. There is plenty of room for the good, the bad, and the ugly. :lol: Secret computing is not safe because only those who stumble upon the secrets can fix the stupid thing. And everything needs to be fixed as the players all get better.

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Hasn't this all happened at least once in the past? What about the "kerbeous" protocol (no, I can't spell that). Didn't microsoft mis-use some open source protocol and then try to call it their own and then threaten everyone? :( .

 

ljones

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MS is so completely under the microscope these days that I doubt they could get away with copying GPL software and bill it as their own. Besides, if they get caught, they will have to GPL everything it's mixed with, something that would make Gates sh!t a brick.

 

Finally, MS using anything Linux related or GPL with their own products would be a public declaration that their own stuff stinks and GPL software is better, and they're not going to do that in a million years.

Edited by JeffSmdk

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Finally, MS using anything Linux related or GPL with their own products would be a public declaration that their own stuff stinks and GPL software is better, and they're not going to do that in a million years.

so true... :lol:

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Hasn't this all happened at least once in the past? What about the "kerbeous" protocol (no, I can't spell that). Didn't microsoft mis-use some open source protocol and then try to call it their own and then threaten everyone? :( .

 

ljones

 

 

actually yes, they have tried it. it was Kerberos. another was INS, which windows users know as WINS. how about the true type fonts? yep. true type fonts are adobe's, so i dont think its gpl'd.

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