Software/smart/KDE 3.5.2/repo's and mirrors

[bigjohn]

Some pointers/direction please?

 

I screwed up this morning - big time!

 

I had got the thac/Ze mirror configured for URPMI, so being a smart arse, I ran the updates section and figured that if I told it to install all the updates it'd be fine. WRONG!

 

When I'd done that, it'd installed the new version of the nvidia driver and promptly decided that it wouldn't start the bloody X server.

 

I did some meddling, to the extent of my knowledge, got no-where and "knee-jerk" re-installed the system.

 

So, I've sort of managed to get the system back up and running.

 

What I don't understand, is, if I then added the thac/Ze repository (where do I get the info on how to do that ) do I still need to have all the other main/contrib/updates/plf (free and non free)/jpackage repositories as well (or would the thac/Ze repo just replace main and/or contrib or something like that)???

 

Also, is it possible to remove the URPMI facility completely or is it still "essential" to a mandriva 2006 install (even though I'm trying to learn how to use smart)?

 

regards

 

John

[ianw1974]

Hi John,

 

With thac's rpms, you still need all the other sources, such as main, contrib, etc, etc. Normally if you have KDE 3.5.2, then KDE 3.4 would have been removed from your system, and therefore this wouldn't be updated.

 

If you are using dkms, which it sounds like you are, then of course this driver would be updated, but technically should be completely independant of KDE anyway, because it's related to xorg.

 

Your other alternative would be not to use dkms altogether, and just manually install the drivers from nvidia's website. That way, you wouldn't be suceptible to an update causing the problem when dkms is updated, etc.

 

I think a post here, must have thac's mirror in somewhere, or you can google for it. I know I've added it using urpmi previously.

 

In relation to urpmi, I'm not sure but it could be a dependancy, therefore if you remove it, you could experience huge problems. I'd be tempted to leave it, and if your preference is smart, then use this with your urpmi sources empty.

[bigjohn]

Thanks for the reply. It would appear that my problem lies somewhere between the new nvidia driver version and maybe dkms (well, I think, anyway).

 

I'd managed to get the system working, and sort of had my head round using smart (mmodem mentioned that it was the prefered method of using smart to run/manage the thac/Ze packages), but I hadn't added their repository. I was just finishing the updating of stuff (including the plf version of dkms-nvidia 8756 - I think thats the number) when I re-started the session and the bloody X server refused to restart.

 

I wasn't sure if it's connected with possible the newer kernel version not being installed (I can't remember if I did that - I think I did as I recall seeing an entry for it on the grub boot screen) or not.

 

My main problem seems to be that because I don't know enough about the system, if I experience problems like the X server not starting, I don't have any other options but to do a "noobesque" re-install. I don't have another PC to check stuff out to try to find out what to do (damn, damn, damn!). I certainly don't have any dual boot access (linux only for nearly 12 months now).

 

Anyhow, for the moment, I've got the system re-installed (again), but will take it one package at a time for getting it back to where it was (hopefully).

 

Any other suggestion you might have is much appreciated.

 

regards

 

John

 

p.s. Yes I can also follow you point about not using dkms, but apart from the nvidia driver, I don't know what else it affects

[ianw1974]

dkms is a service that allows your module to be injected into the kernel. Basically working the same way as the nvidia driver installer, but not manual.

 

During bootup a dkms service starts. If the module isn't installed into your kernel it will install during bootup, and X will start as normal. It could be that when you restarted X it tried to run a module that didn't exist, and caused your problem. Had you rebooted completely, it would have injected the module into the kernel and started. Sometimes, if your kernel was upgraded at the time the updates were applied, this would mean a kernel without the dkms-nvidia module, and therefore, requires a reboot. Firstly, to run the new kernel and secondly to install the nvidia module into it, so that you don't have to then rerun the nvidia installer that you can download direct from Nvidia.

 

I use dkms with nvidia on my system at home, never experienced problems updating, but then I never attempted to restart X without restarting my whole system completely. It can also be used for modem drivers, and other such stuff.

[bigjohn]

Ok, I think I follow that.

 

I've just finished re-installing the system (again). Though a step at a time. Strangely enough, the smart software manager didn't want to upgrade the base kernel that came with the 2006 boxed set. I had to put some URPMI sources in to do that.

 

I'm just checking through now, to see if the new nvidia driver is showing up from the plf source I choose (I usually use anorien@warwick and the canterbury ones plus French and Dutch repo's as I've found that they tend to be the fastest).

 

Still a bit of a mystery though, as although I don't know much about the dkms thing, it's always worked fine - I'm wondering if it was/is anything to do with the way that kernel-sources appear in updates, whereas the actual kernel appears in "software available for install" ? i.e. the old cherry of when you install the nvidia driver manually, and get hit with the "missing headers/sources" error.

 

Oh well, I suppose it's "suck it, and see".

 

regards

 

John

[bigjohn]

Nope! Somethings not right. I had the stuff i.e. the current kernel, kernel-sources etc. I then installed the 8756 nvidia driver from the PLF repo, and as soon as I restart, it won't start the X server.

 

I found a copy of kanotix that I had kicking around, and thats what I'm posting this from

 

Hence I'm at a complete loss as to how I continue i.e. I don't know how to get back to where I was. I did try uninstalling the nvidia driver (the new one), as there had previously appeared to be an earlier one called "nvidia_legacy", but that just gave me a dependency error about there not being a "libnvidia_legacy".

 

So any advice about how I get back into the main system would be much appreciated.

 

I can't use the "nv" driver option, because the nv driver has never given me a decent/usable GUI. Irrespective of what settings I try it on.

 

The problem doesn't seem to be smart or URPMI, it seems to either be the 2.6.12-18 kernel, 2.6.12-18 kernel-sources or the 8756 nvidia driver.

 

Is it possible to get into the 2006 install from kanotix and run the software installer/uninstaller ? or is there another way of doing this?

 

regards

 

John

 

p.s. Yes I could just re-install the "whole shooting match" again, but I'd rather learn how to repair stuff like this, especially as a single linux PC is my only real option.

[ianw1974]

Do you remember which driver version you had previously? I would remove dkms and just use the driver direct from nvidia's website, considering all the problems your having.

 

Switch to "nv" or "vesa" just to get it working, and then remove the dkms and install nvidia's driver for the version you had prior to all the problems.

[bigjohn]

OK, I'll do that and see how I get on. Once I get it going, I'll try the "vesa" driver, because the "nv" one has never given me a usable GUI - weird!

 

regards

 

John

[Ixthusdan]

For thac and Ze's stuff, you must use all of their updates, including xorg updates. I also encountered a problem trying to do "updates" rather than an installation. I ended up uninstalling kde and reinstalling it from cli. You could install gnome or fvwm and then work from a gui, but beware: the urpme uninstalled all the Mandriva tools as well. So, write down a few rpm names beefore you start, just in case you need to be looking at a console! By the way, it is all recoverable, just a lot of fun. B)

[ffi]

Lol me too last week :D Maybe bigjohn has a backup of his xorg.conf from his pre install kde 352 time? usually there´s a xorg.conf~ from just before any changes were made.

 

Anyway I think kde 3.5.2 will be available soon through cooker, some packages are already there....

Edited April 14, 2006 by ffi

[bigjohn]

To be honest, I've found that I have more success with the thac/Ze packages that I ever did with cooker stuff - I have no idea why!

 

As for turning the clock back, yes you're probably correct, there may indeed have been an xorg.conf~ but I don't know how I would have used it. Because if the older version of the nvidia driver (7676 - I think) had already been over written, I don't know how I would have reverted to that.

 

My problem usually lies, not with the packages per se, but more with my impatience i.e. if theres some nice shiney new goodies out there to be had, then WTF! I want 'em NOW! (with accompanying sprinkle of toys, directly from pram :D ).

 

Of course, one day, I'll have the faintest idea of what I'm doing - I was 40 last birthday, so I'll probably be happy with my linux knowledge by the time I'm 137

 

I suspect that until then, I'll continue making stupid mistakes and having to post what most would consider "idiot" questions!

 

Ah well, back to the "time honoured" consolation of the working man. Ciggies and booze.

 

regards

 

John

 

p.s. Oh and just for info, yes I did end up doing the re-install of the base 2006 boxed set version (along with KDE 3.4.2), but after a slow, but sure, one step at a time, method of upgrading the packages, I'm now just downloading the MDE 3.5.2 packages - and bollocks to the newer version of the nvidia driver for the moment. I might have a dig around later too see if anyone else if having problems or whether it's just me!

 

TTFN

[ffi]

Sounds very familiar indeed.

 

I had more or less the same problems last week. I couldn't update mde's packages because I had something from cooker installed and urpmi refused to install because of some dependency. So I was left with a kde uninstall, half a mde xorg upgrade and xorg not starting up and after fixing that refusing to let me into any gui.

 

I have a second partition with linux, if things really get messed up it's easier to fix from there, no messing with vi or emacs, trying out different xorg.conf edits and easy to download the nvidia driver from the nvidia site.

[Ixthusdan]

:lol:

I ended up finding the packages I needed from a knoppix boot, and reinstalled xorg along with Mandriva tools. Then, I installed the mde stuff without any other "impurities" and got the system back up in gui. Of course, linux never faltered; I just had to type everything!

[ffi]

3.5.2has just been released in cooker :D

[bigjohn]

well to be honest, I haven't the faintest idea how I've managed to get back to where I am (kde 3.5.2).

 

When I posted earlier, "it" was happily downloading the mde packages. It must have got through that part, but it had frozen at some point during a package install.

 

A bit of "effing and blinding", a "clout" or two on the keyboard. Nah, I was stuck. I could only log into gnome as root - graphically. So I managed to do that and fire up the software manager/installer.

 

It gave me a complete list of stuff that I "could" download/install. I just did the normal and selected various packages, it didn't download them, it must have already had them in some sort of cache, because as so as I hit the install button it went straight into verifying package signatures etc.

 

When complete I just told it that it was to log into a kde session and bingo (or ognib as they say in backwards land) - here I am.

 

The only thing(s) that I haven't updated are the dkms packages and the nvidia driver. I reckon that I should be alright with the dkms stuff, because the damn X server has refused to start with both the 2006 boxed set dkms packages and the mde ones.

 

Oh and yes, it refused to start this morning (at stupid oclock) with the mde version and later this afternoon with the PLF version. So by that highly scientific method (actually using a brain cell or two) I deduce that it's the bloody nvidia driver.

 

Sod it. I'll wait and see if anyone else has any problems with it. the old version is working ok.

 

regards

 

a very p****d off John!