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bookie

Bootsplash

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Hi again, I thought I'd start a thread to see what interest there is in the original "bootsplash".

 

Most of you are probably aware of the disappearance of bootsplash. It has been superseded by "splashy" Splashy cuts out the compiling of the kernel, which for many of us is a blessing or is it?

 

Many of you know of me or have read my open statements on what I think of Linux. I like many others put my size tens right in the ****. I am also very honest and say what I think which has its merits but not always welcome.

 

I am here now asking you all to make a little sacrifice and write your feelings about "bootsplash" being replaced by "splashy".

 

I have tested splashy and, at the risk of drawing an arsenal of "what are you talking about" out of the wood work - think that splashy doesn't hit it yet!

 

From the comments I have read on the NET, I think, like them that "splashy" is untidy and isn't the fastest at getting going.

 

Like I said I want all your comments (not just the negative ones or positive) so we can see if I am waisting my time in thinking that the developers of bootsplash would reconsider and continue providing us with a product that we have become accustomed to.

 

I am obviously uncertain of how we can affect the powers that be, but it is our using their products that make them what they are today?

 

Please, please help me to bring back bootsplash!!

 

I know that most of you here have tested and will keep on testing different distros. Isn't that what makes Linux great?!

 

I have approached several other forums to try and start a trend and who knows?????

 

Thanks for your time

 

 

bookie :)

Edited by bookie

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I haven't used splashy, at least not seen it appear in Gentoo which is what I use when I normally set up the splash side of things. Although, I would expect that it will continue to be used for some time by one distro or another. Perhaps that specific distro would maintain it or modify it to their needs for any new kernel that comes out.

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To be honest I don't even know what draws the bootsplash screen in my distro (Mandriva 2008). I'm just glad I don't have to recompile a kernel module to change it. Splashy not fast enough? I don't know why speed is so important for a program which just draws a picture and a progress bar. It just can't be that slow that I could recognize it.

AFAIK the development of bootsplash was finished long ago. As I see it we have a better alternative now. So why should we resurrect bootsplash? It did its job then but time has changed. Tell the bootsplash developers instead to help develop splashy.

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Hi guys, like I said your comments are valid - what ever you have to say :D

 

The reason I thought I'd start this thread is people keep telling me I can't be afraid to get my feet wet with Linux?! ;) Getting your feet wet is working with Linux from the ground up?!

 

 

I agree about splashy being able to develop into something great with time. Why should bootsplash be sacrificed at the expense of splashy?

 

I have read so many comments about bootsplash with the patches being more stable than splashy?

 

Patching the kernel the debian way isn't so hard?! I am still getting to grips with everything Linux - just think something shouldn't fade away because of new stuff coming around :D

 

Take Slackware for example. There is a distro you really have to get your feet wet!! What is wrong with that. I am the first to opt for the easiest way out regarding having a nice stable distro and know ground work. That (forgive me if I am wrong) I have learned becomes very boring with time :zzz:

 

Keep your comments coming :thumbs:

 

It is my hope that those who are a little put off with the idea of compiling will become better at understanding Linux by TRYING :lol2:

 

bookie

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My 2c: I only once managed to change bootsplashes. Various upgrades and reinstalls plus a lack of documentation from my side how I accomplised this have taken care of that. At this time I am 'splashless', possibly because I boot in 1024x768 rather than standard 800x600 mode (or that is at least my closest guess; vga=791 instead of vga=788). The only gripes I had with bootsplash (apart from being somewhat hard to understand) were (1) -- the MCC-wizzard sort of never worked (though it did generate files in various places) and (2) the default mandriva ones are a bit boring after a while. Neither is areal issue and I probably do not care enough about it to really figure it out. If splashy is better documented and easier to change OK.

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Hi pindakoe, thanks for stopping by :D

 

I don't think that splashy is documented more than bootsplash - it's just that several distros are starting to adopt it!

 

I haven't looked at the bootsplash on the Mandriva side yet, but the general consensus is that bootsplash patches are more stable than splashy :unsure:

 

Debian has been using the patches for the kernel and bootsplash is still available for the present kernel but then it stops!!

 

I am doing a compile the kernel the Debian way (been done before) but thought I'd do an update to show the advantages of bootsplash from an idiot's point of view (me being the idiot) :lol2: It really amounts to what we want in a distro? Do we want it easy and painless then bootsplash wouldn't appeal to everyone. I am hoping to show that it doesn't have to be toooooooo painful using bootsplash instead of splashy :)

 

I am still doing research but can post that compile How To here at Mandriva if anyone is interested?

 

 

As we all know, Mandriva is probably one of the more user friendly distros (don't like Windows as the comparison) that is on the market at the moment :thumbs:

 

 

It doesn't mean that we can't get out feet wet if we want - just that people seeing the light and coming to Linux get an easy time adjusting to the Linux way of doing things B)

 

 

 

bookie

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I am sorry that so few of you have come in contact with bootsplash?!

 

 

There is no point in putting energy into something if people are not interested?!

 

As far as I am concerned. this thread is closed

 

Thanks to those who took the time to comment

 

bookie

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bootsplash is a dirty ugly hack. It embeds a custom and poorly documented jpeg loader into the kernel. It has no hope of ever being merged.

 

bootsplash was always primitive anyway, never had a great deal of capability and was always limited by the fact it depends on a kernel patch.

 

Implemented correctly, splashy is far superior, and far cleaner. It's more capable, and importantly, its entirely in userspace. fbsplash isnt too shabby either.

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Well, it is obvious that we are not speaking the same language - because it is just that that the kernel needed a patch that made it so stable?!!!

 

I it is a shame that people wish to comment when I clearly posted yesterday that there was a lack of interest and wouldn't be waisting any more time on it.

 

 

Perhaps I should make my self clear!! Bootsplash will continue to be a project for many even though it hasn't found any interest here at Mandriva.

 

The term getting your feet wet hasn't any meaning here!! :lol2:

 

After patching and compiling your kernel which, unless you really need specific changes, can be an old compile. After being installed the kernel is stable and gives you a good stable start up splash and shut down splash. You can even put in a nice grub jpeg at boot if you like without too much trouble.

 

Where do you think splashy came from? :mellow:

 

 

It seems to me that folk only want to have a dig without really understanding anything at all behind bootsplash :wall:

 

 

bookie

Edited by bookie

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I it is a shame that people wish to comment when I clearly posted yesterday that there was a lack of interest and wouldn't be waisting any more time on it.
Yesterday was the first day I ever saw this discussion thread; I'm probably not the only one.

 

Perhaps I should make my self clear!! Bootsplash will continue to be a project for many even though it hasn't found any interest here at Mandriva.
That's the power of free software; it will survive as long as someone is interested in maintaining it; this someone may be you :)

 

The term getting your feet wet hasn't any meaning here!! :lol2:
English is not my mother-tongue, so I may be wrong, but my feeling is that this sentence is somewhat aggressive... Please don't do that; you can't generalize on such things.

 

After patching and compiling your kernel which, unless you really need specific changes, can be an old compile. After being installed the kernel is stable and gives you a good stable start up splash and shut down splash. You can even put in a nice grub jpeg at boot if you like without too much trouble.
I can't comment on bootsplash stability. However, whatever this stability is, the simple fact that it runs inside the kernel is a security risk, and many many Linux users (especially in enterprises) care a lot more about security than about a nice jpeg at boot.

 

It seems to me that folk only want to have a dig without really understanding anything at all behind bootsplash :wall:
Quite the contrary, see my previous answer. It's just that different users have different priorities, and different needs. Hence different software may coexist for those different goals.

 

Yves.

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The term getting your feet wet hasn't any meaning here!! :lol2:

 

After patching and compiling your kernel which, unless you really need specific changes, can be an old compile. After being installed the kernel is stable and gives you a good stable start up splash and shut down splash. You can even put in a nice grub jpeg at boot if you like without too much trouble.

And splashy can do it without any kernel modifications. That in itself is a great advantage. It's not a matter of "getting your feet wet" -- it's a matter of practicality.

 

Bootsplash is a _dated_ and now inferior implementation. Not to take anything away from it - it served reliably during it's time, but now it's time has passed.

 

Mandriva (and it's derivatives) is the last distro I know of that uses/has used bootsplash (I havn't checked the latest releases).

 

Requiring a kernel patch is a great disadvantage, and in bootsplash' current implementation, these include:

  • It embeds a jpeg loader in the kernel. This is a dirty hack by today's standards, where there are multiple implementations that prove this is not neccesary
  • Putting a jpeg loader into the kernel raises extra security concerns.
  • In kernel space, there is _no_ memory protection. A bug in the jpeg loader, could potentially corrupt ram, cause data loss, difficult to trace bugs elsewhere, or simply crashes. Another reason why it should be in userspace
  • Because of the above, it will never be merged into the vanilla kernel
  • The bootsplash implementation is poorly documented, and as the original authors have long ditched it, there exists nobody with the knowledge _and_ enthusiasm to maintain it. The fbsplash author attempted to work it out, and decided it would be easier to write his own (fbsplash).
  • In the kernel it is feature limited, difficult to configure, requires very invasive modification to work on any distro
  • It can, and has been done better, with other implementations putting only the bare minimum in the kernel (fbsplash+fbcondecor), and others nothing (fbsplash/splashy).

So in short. It sucks by _today's_ standards.

 

Where do you think splashy came from? :mellow:

People who realised that bootsplash has big flaws, and a new implementation was needed.

 

It seems to me that folk only want to have a dig without really understanding anything at all behind bootsplash :wall:

Not making a blind dig at all. I know bootsplash _very_ well, along with it's successors. From maintaining patches to updating initscripts. I _could_ keep it up to date, but it's not worth it.

 

Put your time towards another implementation such as splashy or fbsplash/fbcondecor. You could pursue bootsplash, it's open source after all, but expect a lot more of the above.

 

James

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That'll be what I'm using in Gentoo then - fbsplash and fbcondecor. :)

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Administrative note: the original poster of this thread has asked that it be closed. We apologize for not "catching it" but closing a thread is generally done for more serious matters than loss of interest in the topic. If you pm a mod/admin, things happen a bit faster. I agree with Yves that posting a topic really requires time for people to see it. Anyone wishing to start a new discussion on this subject is free to do so, as the closing is not the result of any management decision.

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bookie has requested that this thread remain open in order to allow discussion to continue. Great efforts discover things that no one knew needed discovery. But without exploration, only the mundane is known.

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I thank Ixthusdan for reopening the thread because I feel that there is still a lot to be learned by having an open dialogue :)

 

I am not here to start a war about who is right and who is wrong about bootsplash! All I know is working with bootsplash the Debian way is far superior to splashy. Splashy was untidy and didn't do it for me!! Me is singular B)

 

I implemented splashy and found that the verbose ran for quite a while before the splash and quite a while after the splash before I came to the login splash.

 

I tried to everything to improve on that - but couldn't?

 

If there is anyone interested, then I would like to understand the way the splash is implemented in Mandriva? I would then give the comparison for bootsplash the Debian way. Please don't forget that I am talking about the Debian way when I talk about the differences between splashy and bootsplash.

 

I am doing this to learn more about Linux not start a slanging match :mellow:

 

There are surely those who don't consider getting their feet wet as being aggressive on my part :)

 

 

Linux can be fun even if it means compiling a kernel or two? :D

 

I will not respond to snide comments!! I respect opinions as long as they are not aimed at me personally.

 

bookie

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