mdk 2007.0 official, woes and woes

[ianw1974]

So, the questions :

 

1- How can I force the 64 Bits install AND still use the noapic nolapic tweak?

 

Unsure on this, but press F3 I think, and see what it says next. Maybe you can catch what is says on screen when it loads, perhaps "linux 64" or something like that.

 

2- Is my processor a i686, or a x86_64 and which update sources shall I use?

 

x86_64 if you're using the 64 bit version, otherwise you are i586 or i686. Of course, most of the easyurpmi stuff says i586. Kernels can however be i686, and are better for faster system.

 

3- Once KDE is running how do I know which architecture of software was installed?arch tell me i686 but I think that is only the type of cpu, not the mdv version.

 

That's mostly the kernel and stuff related like this. Packages will have the version in their name, but depends normally on the packager and how and what they compiled them for. Unless you compile them from source. Usually rpm's are coded for i386 or around that so that they work across a wide variety of platforms, than have them create i686 only packages. Eventually i686 will prob become the norm, as old machines will disappear after a while and they won't make the distro for them.

[Helmut]

Thanks DarkFoss, John, Gowator!

 

At the moment there still remains a minor problem about creating a desktop-link to my numerous hard drives. They are mostly in vfat and contain documents, pics, and you name it.

 

There are all mounted as:

/local/drivename

While on KDE opened a Konsole and typed "kdesu konqueror" and looked at the permissions. These are

for /local:

Ownership: me

Group: users

Access permissions are 777 (and no special bits set.)

 

for /local/drivedrivename (for all drive names) they are:

Ownership root

Group: root

Access permissions 777 (and no special bits set.)

 

When trying to change ownership to me in Konqueror as root, a warning pops up "Warning Could not modify ownership for /local/drivedrivename because you have insufficient access to perform change"

 

Also, as root I made a link on the root desktop to /local This link can not be removed. When trying to do so, it says "can not ...on a different file system"

 

Any ideas?

Cheers,

Helmut

Edited October 16, 2006 by Helmut

[Gowator]

Yep its quite simple.... the FAT partitions don't honour file ownership so when they are mounted they are mounted as an owner.

This is just a restriction on the actual filesystem....

So when the filesystem is mounted you can't change the permissions since /local/<xxx> is then logically part of the tree with a FAT...

You need to unmount the FAT part's top change ownership

From a CLI this is (or use a GUI tool to unmount)

umount -a -t vfat

 

Then you can change ownership....

 

HOWEVER....

When you do mount

 

From man mount

 

uid=value and gid=value

Set the owner and group of all files. (Default: the uid and gid of the current process.)

In other words add -o uid=500 gid=500

(these are I think the mandriva defaults for the first created account - you can check from a console by typing id)

Also to make them user mountable -users (after the -o) this is not FAT specific, it just means a nornal user can mount/unmount the devices.

 

 

Also, as root I made a link on the root desktop to /local This link can not be removed. When trying to do so, it says "can not ...on a different file system"

Erm, don't make links as root.(really try and use even kdesu konqueror as something to do occaisionally, its very easy to delete a whole tree of stuff or change permissions etc.).. to get rid of it you can delete in when the fs is unmounted....

or from a console

rm /root/Desktop/local.Desktop

or delete it from an su'd konqueror (kommander has a su mode too... you start is as nornal user and can switch to su mode and back)

[Helmut]

Thanks, Gowater,

You were totally right again! Once the vfat partitions/drives were unmounted, the "ownership" could be changed as root, and then I could login (without rebooting) as the user. Then with the unmounted partitions, a link between them and the desktop could be made. After rebooting the shown ownership goes back to "root" automatically, but the links work and the files are totally accessable.

 

While understanding your point about not logging in as root perfectly well, for someone totally ignorant to operating a terminal, the MCC logged in as root often remains the only other way to do certain things. I need it only very seldom, but there is simply no graphical replacement that comes to mind. Thats why I can not do without it, no matter how seldom it is needed. For that reason I am now using a different distro, but I hope to find time to switch back later - of course after I see a solution for the "no login as root" problem. I have tried very long with consoles and their commands, and that is not an option for me. If it were, maybe I would be running BSD, who knows...

Greets,

Helmut

Edited October 17, 2006 by Helmut

[Gowator]

Helmut, Im not 100% sure but I think the MCC is always running as root. That's why you have to type the password when you start it... (either that or it requests root when it needs it) ...

[Helmut]

Yeah, right again.

But its not only the MCC, some things can only be done logged in as root with a graphical interface for "Terminal-ignorants" like me.

Cheers,

Helmut

Edited October 17, 2006 by Helmut

[lawsonrc]

Helmut,

What new distro are you using that is working????

 

 

Richard

[Helmut]

What new distro are you using that is working????

I'm using SUSE 10.1 now. It works fine, but the packet mgr seems so slow and apparently has a few similar hiccups like mdk2007, and it also boots much slower than mdk. And of course, if you are used to mdk it seems sooooo bloated and sooo slow. But then again, SUSE is not too much different from Fedora, it seems. Anyhow, main thing Linux! You can always adjust any Linux distro to make it suit your needs I suppose.

 

Cheers,

Helmut

[oshunluvr]

...every time the system boots up anew, a popup opens "Wait installing", and then a second one also opens "Please wait installing packages", then a third popup opens "ERROR Could not install the CUPS printing system". But I just ignore that and continue anyway, after all, the printer (hp psc1100) works fine.

I had this exact problem when I was using "mona" (beta 2 or 3 I think). Believe it or not it fixed itself when; after having many problems I thought were related to 3d-desktop, I uninstalled the 3d-desktop nvidia packages, mesa-demos and compiz packages. When I restarted x and logged in VOILA! instead of the cups error I got "Installing Packages" and then it never came back, even when I later reinstalled the 3d-desktop stuff. My best guess is there is a dependancy conflict that requires the cups packages to be installed first but the install program (I my opinion buggy in almost every release of mandriva since mandrake 7.0) doesn't do it in the right order. Another good reason not to install so many packages at initial install. To bad there isn't better error messages in this regard.

 

The next surprise: "Root Logins not allowed"! No, this is not a sick joke, and I'm not kidding, no root logins allowed!

Remember, the reason for me having Mandriva is because I just can not remember the syntax needed on a Konsole, and Mandriva/Mandrake always had the best graphical tools that make consoles just about superflous. But with 2007, I cannot login as root,

I too sometimes find it expediant to log in as root, usually when I am first installing and setting up a system. I get tired of continually entering the root password (the "remember" box doesn't always work as advertised and logging in and out or restarting X defeats it anyway) and frequently kdesu or launching from the konsole results in errors (years of documentation on this issue haven't resolved anything). You may be able to allow root logins by editing kdmrc - I'll let you know if I figure it out.

 

By the way, Mandriva 2007 has no proper AC97 sound driver (2005 SE did!), and the nvidia 3D driver seems to be missing too. Good I don't need 3D, one thing less to worry about.

I'm not sure what you mean by "proper" driver but my AC97 imbedded card works fine. I have trouble with arts once in while but I don't think it's driver related. Also, I have an nvidia 6600 and 3d works fine. If your using a "free" version of mandriva the drivers are not included because they're not "free". This sounds like you have "X" issues that you could look into (you mentioned pther X problems with previous versions of mandriva/mandrake). The easiest solution to the nvidia driver for free versions is to update your urpmi sources (easyurpmi.zarb.org) and then install "dkms" and the "dkms-nvidia" packages and nvidia kernel source (should be a dependancy). THEN READ the readme file. You'll need to edit your /etc/X11/xorg.conf file to activate the newer driver and openGL. Could also just be your card is too old to support 3d - there are web resources that will tell you what cards support it.

[willie]

Yeah, right again.

But its not only the MCC, some things can only be done logged in as root with a graphical interface for "Terminal-ignorants" like me.

Cheers,

Helmut

I do all the root things with a graphical interface and never log in as root with a graphical interface, i use the nice little programm called "DoAsRoot".

For example: I open konqueror go to /etc/modprobe.preload right-click on it and choose action/edit as root.

I change it, save it and close it and the changes are made as root. And after closing the editor i'm root off and again a normale user.

Edited October 19, 2006 by willie

[Gowator]

...every time the system boots up anew, a popup opens "Wait installing", and then a second one also opens "Please wait installing packages", then a third popup opens "ERROR Could not install the CUPS printing system". But I just ignore that and continue anyway, after all, the printer (hp psc1100) works fine.

I had this exact problem when I was using "mona" (beta 2 or 3 I think). Believe it or not it fixed itself when; after having many problems I thought were related to 3d-desktop, I uninstalled the 3d-desktop nvidia packages, mesa-demos and compiz packages. When I restarted x and logged in VOILA! instead of the cups error I got "Installing Packages" and then it never came back, even when I later reinstalled the 3d-desktop stuff. My best guess is there is a dependancy conflict that requires the cups packages to be installed first but the install program (I my opinion buggy in almost every release of mandriva since mandrake 7.0) doesn't do it in the right order. Another good reason not to install so many packages at initial install. To bad there isn't better error messages in this regard.

This really does bear up to my personal experience. I have had the least problems by installing the absolute minimum in the installation itself and then installing what I need.

 

The same goes for the updates ... It has rarely worked while installing and basically as you say once the package install gets screwed somehow it seems to make a real big mess...

I know its not exactly newbie friendly and if its someones first install its confusing but I really think if people choose the absolute minimum they will have far less probs. They can then update once its all working (and have less downloads) and add the packages they want ....

 

The next surprise: "Root Logins not allowed"! No, this is not a sick joke, and I'm not kidding, no root logins allowed!

Remember, the reason for me having Mandriva is because I just can not remember the syntax needed on a Konsole, and Mandriva/Mandrake always had the best graphical tools that make consoles just about superflous. But with 2007, I cannot login as root,

I too sometimes find it expediant to log in as root, usually when I am first installing and setting up a system. I get tired of continually entering the root password (the "remember" box doesn't always work as advertised and logging in and out or restarting X defeats it anyway) and frequently kdesu or launching from the konsole results in errors (years of documentation on this issue haven't resolved anything). You may be able to allow root logins by editing kdmrc - I'll let you know if I figure it out.

 

Its a single line in kdmrc, just "allow root logins=true" but i still think it is likely to cause more problems than not.

Willie answers that pretty much so ...

 

The real basis for this is Linux isn't designed to be running a GUI as root. In many ways its more prone to messing stuff up than running windows as administrator because the safeguards are just not in place.

 

There are also an increasing number of applications which will not run as root because the programmers deliberatly add this safety check into the code.

 

If you stop and think "why would they do this?" then its because the security risks are too high and they would be forced to write loads of extra code just securing it (and even then it wouldn't be so secure) and in this context secure doesn't just mean being hacked it includes user error etc.

 

Now many programs do run as root... so perhaps the arguament is if they can then they all can?

I tend to think its the safety concious who do this and while some progs are designed to be run as root many just assume the user is not going to attempt running the prog as root.

 

Running any app as root when logged in as a normal user is pretty simple...and adding it to the menu is also easy. For example if you want to edit config files just add a second entry for your favorite editor ..running kdesu...

 

The only other real problem running progs as root (apart from those that will not run as root) is allowing root to access the desktop .. this is done using xhost ... and again can be added to your menu like

xhost + localhost

 

If you add

export DISPLAY=:0.0 to the root .bashrc then you can just type then name of the program you need

(If you don't know the name then you can just run it as a user and check the process manager....)

 

As willie says you can also use utilities but even without this if you right click on a file in konqueror and choose open with you can just type

kdesu kate

for instance for an editor running as root opening that file as root.

[Helmut]

Gowater,

 

A single line in kdmrc?

 

Could you explain, please?

 

Oh, and as far as X problems go, neither the current Nvidia 6200 nor the old Nvidia mx440 worked with 2006.

 

Cheers,

Helmut

Edited October 19, 2006 by Helmut

[Gowator]

Sure its

/etc/kde3/kdm/kdmrc

and change

AllowRootLogin=false

to

AllowRootLogin=true

 

But be so kind as to add that you are running the desktop as root to your signature so people who read it can choose wether to answer your questions when you bork the system.

 

I'm not saying I won't help... but I certainly wouldn't give you priority over helping someone else who is not doing the linux equaivalent of self-harm so I would answer your posts when I have finished helping others. It wouldn't be fair to do otherwise IMHO.

 

Equally anyone helping you needs to know this or they will bork your system by assuming you are running as a user and tell you to do something that will bork your system as root.

 

However as I already told you before you don't need to edit anything to run X as root, just stop the login manager and start X directly...

 

As root

init 3

/etc/init.d/dm stop

then login

then startkde

 

However this is pretty much guaranteed to bork your system for your user sooner or later.... unless you really know what you are doing... since you will be creating things or over writing things your user has no permissions for.

 

You can also just boot directly into a root desktop... no need to use a login manager at all.

just change the startup scripts to start Xorg at boot instead of dm.

[Helmut]

Thanks for the explanation, Gowater.

I'm not planning to run the desktop as root, was just curious what it was about.

Cheers,

Helmut

[Gowator]

Thanks for the explanation, Gowater.

I'm not planning to run the desktop as root, was just curious what it was about.

Cheers,

Helmut

What Im saying is you can edit the kdmrc but if you do you get into a habit of using it instead of figuring out the correct way and 99% of stuff can be done with a GUI, you just need to find the right tool.

 

(it might take a lot longer in a GUI or it may be less optimal because the GUI might not give all the options)

 

However if on a oneoff you need to run as root you can just start the X session AS root.... by stopping the login manager

(I forgot, when you finish restart it with /etc/init.d/dm start)

 

Also make sure you do let people know.... its honestly very simple to wreck something just by presuming the person is running as a user ... obviously in a perfect world advice would start ...

if you are running as root then ...... first OR only do this as a user NOT root. but its not a perfecdt world and we mostly assume the convention...

 

i was helping a friend on IRC last night and he wasa trying to start gtk-gnutella BUT he had opened a terminal ans was doing it as root so when I tried to tell him do x,y it didn't actually work and had I not caught on (easier live on IRC) I could well have wrecked something.