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Internet connection through electricity network


Darkelve
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I was wondering if anyone could give me some more info about a new technology,

something called "HomePlug", which allows you to send network data over the electricity

network via an adapter you plug into your power plug and your computer.

 

Right now we have a DSL connection hooked up to a Wired+Wireless Accesspoint (Intel WAP 2011b or something like that). We have a mixed environment of desktop computers and laptops. Most computers run a version of Windows, my computer and laptop run Linux (dual-boot with Windows used for games and specialty applications).

 

I have problems because the signal has to run through walls... also the range isn't good enough to, for example, take my laptop and sit on the terrace with it (card just barely receives a signal but won't connect).

 

So I was wondering if this technology would be useful for our purposes. I found a couple of companies offering such adapters, for example Netgear and Devolo/Microlink.

 

The nice thing about Devolo is that they offer Linux drivers and installation software/instructions , and that there's an ethernet interface on the adapter as well as a USB one (also with Linux support):

 

http://www.devolo.com/co_EN/produkte/dlan/...starterkit.html

 

I'm also not 100% sure what the difference between all the versions of these adapters is...

 

 

The Audio adapter seems interesting also... something my dad would probably appreciate very much.

 

That is, if it works as advertised.

 

 

I'm always sceptic about these new-new technologies though, so I thought I'd ask around to see if anyone has experience with it and can advise me if it's useful for my purposes or not.

 

 

 

Anyway, I'll end my rant here and wait for feedback. :)

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I thought about this at one time and went wireless instead. Although the frequency range is different, there is a noise level in electrical liones that is unavoidable. Noise, by definition, affects all frequency ranges in a line.

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So what are the implications of that? Slower connection? Less range? Something else? ...

 

 

 

I thought about this at one time and went wireless instead. Although the frequency range is different, there is a noise level in electrical liones that is unavoidable. Noise, by definition, affects all frequency ranges in a line.
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So what are the implications of that? Slower connection? Less range? Something else? ...

 

I thought about this at one time and went wireless instead. Although the frequency range is different, there is a noise level in electrical liones that is unavoidable. Noise, by definition, affects all frequency ranges in a line.

Reliability, speed and also security if you are in an appt building with shared phase.

 

I would think about just either upgrade to a 802.11G but run it at 11Mbit for range... or simply add a wired repeater...

 

With a bit of thought Cat -5 is not so obstrusive if you have enough of it.. my experience is buying premade lengths is expensive and you end up cutting corners... buy a roll for about €40 for 3000m (seriously) and the little tools for crimping (usually also good for RJ-11 telephone)

 

You can get flat Cat-3 (10 mbit) even cheaper.... and its less obtrusive under carpets etc. but with a small amount of work with self adhesive clips etc. its easy to wire around things, behind sofa's etc.

 

This way your dealing with tried and tested stuff.

 

If you could meet a Thalys on the 27th or 31st in Brussels my GF is passing through and I have a whole box of cable and stuff. Thinking she might be less than organised on the return trip... from Amsterdam!

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Reliability, speed and also security if you are in an appt building with shared phase.

 

It's a private home, but I don't know a lot about electrical/electronical stuff... I have a friend that can help me with that though. Also the data is said to be enc

 

"I would think about just either upgrade to a 802.11G but run it at 11Mbit for range... or simply add a wired repeater... "

 

Yeah, I thought about that as well... anyway, whatever I buy, most wireless stuff seems to be pretty expensive (€50 up to €200).

 

"With a bit of thought Cat -5 is not so obstrusive if you have enough of it."

 

For my room that is a problem... the cable modem is downstairs, my room is upstairs... the only way to put the cable would be to drill holes in the wall (not going there) or let it run along the staircase (done that, not going there either).

 

Also I'd like to be able to connect in my our garden... which isn't that far from the modem, but it's a problem for the wireless signal... like you said, an extender might help, but there's a power socket over there as well. So I'm just seeing what solution would be the most practical.

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"slower connection, more dropped packets, more packet collisions...basically it could create an unstable/unreliable connection (if the interference is bad enough)."

 

I'm using a wireless connection right now... I've got lots of dropped packets, I think because there's a wall and ceiling in between, even though my room isn't far away from the access point physically. Just down the stairs and after the door into the next room...

 

I was hoping for less dropped packets this way, so if there would be more, it would be no use... or maybe I just have to buy a more powerful access point/router (I suspect the current one isn't really all that) or a range repeater or what's it called.

 

slower connection, more dropped packets, more packet collisions...basically it could create an unstable/unreliable connection (if the interference is bad enough).
Edited by Darkelve
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"slower connection, more dropped packets, more packet collisions...basically it could create an unstable/unreliable connection (if the interference is bad enough)."

 

I'm using a wireless connection right now... I've got lots of dropped packets, I think because there's a wall and ceiling in between, even though my room isn't far away from the access point physically. Just down the stairs and after the door into the next room...

Floors often have steel girders etc.

I would think about putting the 1st access point at the bottom of the stairs and the second pretty much in line of sight at the top.

Remember they have vertical antenna' (usually) so the best signal is in the same plane....

 

Your ideal solution would be to borrow one and try it out.

 

Also consider putting the first one on a longer lead.... you can be more flexible and move it around to get better reception elsewhere .(Im guessing it goes straight intot he phone)... with a bit of thought the lead can go behind a table etc. If you use something like Kwifi and a laptop you can monitor signal strengh and play about with where the router is placed. Sometimes it can be really far from obvious because of hidden structures and wiring and pipes etc. inside walls and floors. If you need to move it to get better reception on the terrace (you must have better weather now ) you can just extend it temporarily on the lead and put it back after.

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"Also consider putting the first one on a longer lead.... you can be more flexible and move it around to get better reception elsewhere

 

(Im guessing it goes straight intot he phone)"

 

Straight into the Cable Modem... so I suppose that's a 'yes'. Not a bad idea... still trouble with long wires, but less trouble since it'll still be on the same floor.

 

"If you need to move it to get better reception on the terrace (you must have better weather now ) you can just extend it temporarily on the lead and put it back after."

 

Yes, I wanted to do that when the weather was so hot over here... one of the few bearable spots for sitting with a computer, especially with the heat they produce themselves.

 

So I did sit outside a couple of times, but it was a bummer not to be able to get a connection.

 

 

"slower connection, more dropped packets, more packet collisions...basically it could create an unstable/unreliable connection (if the interference is bad enough)."

 

I'm using a wireless connection right now... I've got lots of dropped packets, I think because there's a wall and ceiling in between, even though my room isn't far away from the access point physically. Just down the stairs and after the door into the next room...

Floors often have steel girders etc.

I would think about putting the 1st access point at the bottom of the stairs and the second pretty much in line of sight at the top.

Remember they have vertical antenna' (usually) so the best signal is in the same plane....

 

Your ideal solution would be to borrow one and try it out.

 

Also consider putting the first one on a longer lead.... you can be more flexible and move it around to get better reception elsewhere .(Im guessing it goes straight intot he phone)... with a bit of thought the lead can go behind a table etc. If you use something like Kwifi and a laptop you can monitor signal strengh and play about with where the router is placed. Sometimes it can be really far from obvious because of hidden structures and wiring and pipes etc. inside walls and floors. If you need to move it to get better reception on the terrace (you must have better weather now ) you can just extend it temporarily on the lead and put it back after.

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I've played with the stuff from Netgear - they even have a plug adapter now for wireless - so you can have both. It works really well. Obviously it is not intended for enterprise-level networking just yet, but is just fine for your home setup.

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The idea is not new, there were gadgets around for the BBC computer in the 1980s called "Red Boxes" - you would get one and plug it into the BBC, and then plug an appliance / sensor into another one. It was very VERY low bandwidth, just for switching things on/off, or connecting eg motion sensors without trailing extra cables. The Guardian mentions it briefly here.

 

For using it as a networking tech, you'd have a lot of problems to overcome, I imagine. And don't even think about using the network while the wife is hoovering :)

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"Also consider putting the first one on a longer lead.... you can be more flexible and move it around to get better reception elsewhere

 

(Im guessing it goes straight intot he phone)"

 

Straight into the Cable Modem... so I suppose that's a 'yes'. Not a bad idea... still trouble with long wires, but less trouble since it'll still be on the same floor.

 

"If you need to move it to get better reception on the terrace (you must have better weather now ) you can just extend it temporarily on the lead and put it back after."

 

Yes, I wanted to do that when the weather was so hot over here... one of the few bearable spots for sitting with a computer, especially with the heat they produce themselves.

 

So I did sit outside a couple of times, but it was a bummer not to be able to get a connection.

What I meant is you can leave it fixed but when you need to use the connection outside put it in a better place. 90% of the time the wires can just be behind the table, in a box etc. and you only need see them when you move it.

 

Also those little self adhesive clips work wonders ... just stick to the skirting board .. and if it bothers you you can paint them the same colour and the cable too. If you move you can rub off the self adhesive stuff with a bit of soapy water. IKEA sells packs of 50 for about 3€ for speaker wire.

 

Im guessing the cable modem is flat cable? just standard RJ11 connecter and CAT 3 (just google google images)

Its really easy to hide this stuff because it goes flat .. MY GF is an anti-cable person so Im experienced!

 

I found that the more cable you have to play with the better you hide it. Its trying to stretch it that causes problems because it ends up poking out here and there.

 

If you have a carpet it can just be tucked under, usually carpets have little metal attachments on the floor or are just stuck down... either way if you buy the cable you can just leave it after you move and not worry, just cut the ends off flush.

 

The crimpers are worth it because you can custom make cable and fit it through holes that already exist easier .. for instance along the electrical conduits...you mightbe able to borrow these from work etc.

 

If you undo a plug on the wall if its reasonably modern it goes into a plastic conduit (pipe) and usually there is loads of room for a cable but the ends don't fit or keep snagging ... if your lucky the electricians left a piece of string inside to pull stuff through! Make sure the power is off of course (easier to do in summer)

 

This isn't great for interference .. but its not that bad either.

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Well, after evaluating all of the options and researching a lot of info, I made the decision to try out these HomePlug things. I imagined dozens of situations, but in order to get the experience I want, I would have to replace all 802.11b devices with faster wireless stuff... And even a Wireless router that's powerful enough to help is still more expensive thant 2 or 3 of these Homeplug Network Adapter things...

 

So all in all, I think this is probably the best solution for me after all. If it works as advertised, that is...

 

I sent a mail to the companies making this stuff to see how well they react and if that's not too disappointing, I'll go on ahead and try it. I'm interested in new techology anyways, so I'm kind of curious to be able to try it out. And if it turns out to be garbage, at least I'll be a bit wiser :)

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