Jump to content
null

"rolling" distros vs. "fresh install" distros

Recommended Posts

Gentoo is probably the most complicated installation as you have to also decide for yourself if you want to do a stage 1, stage 2 or stage 3 installation, apart from all the other things to consider.

 

Linux from Scratch is the hardest and I would never do it again. I absolutely hated it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My comment was related to the options he considered installing and out of those, Gentoo is the most complicated installation. And... which sane person builds his/her system with LFS again and again and again? :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gentoo has gotten rid of the Stage 1/2/3 choice - they no longer give that option up front (though it's still there for those who want it)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I guess maybe I'll try a debian system. This is gonna be on my win2k box as a dual-boot. Like I mentioned before, I'm taking some online university courses, so I need to keep my working win2k system. I'll be sure to backup my current work (MS project files, etc) before attempting to install debian.

 

I'll stop asking questions here. When I get to the point of actually doing it, I'll post in other linux distros...

 

oh yeah, debian installs are not known for "trashing" a windows install are they ? :o

 

i have 2 hard drives in my windows box, but I don't know much about MBRs and all that stuff...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No, Debian will not trash your Windows (unless you voluntarily do something stupid). I have never encountered a Debian system trashing a second OS, be it Linux or Windows.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
unless you voluntarily do something stupid

 

:lol2: well, its possible, although not likely... if I run into any roadblocks, I'll post on mub with my mandriva box...!

 

Its just that I've always read that the debian installer was not the easiest.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Use GenieOS and it will be a breeze. ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
My comment was related to the options he considered installing and out of those, Gentoo is the most complicated installation. And... which sane person builds his/her system with LFS again and again and again? :rolleyes:
It doesn't take much longer than gentoo. I would do it on a weekend. My third install was half done with scripts I wrote to minimize the process. The idea was to finish the scripts and release as an 'easy lfs' but that would have required constant updating and I decided to theme instead of distro build. Besides, most people with the ability to do lfs, are not sane to begin with :lol2:

 

All distros have rolled on my systems, so I don't care what the technical name is and what happens on a server as far as roll or freeze. Linux is linux and distros are distros and the one that's good at it now will sooner or later disappoint you. I went to ubuntu after debian unstable bit me twice. The best for me were/are mandriva (mdk) and ubuntu. I ran mandrake from 9.1 to 2005LE upgrading via urpmi/cooker/\release/cooker/\release. Now I have ubuntu from warty-beta to current dapper. I probably won't go devel this time, because I just wanna work, and don't want to deal with anything breaking anymore. There's always that very good chance.

 

So, of course a clean install is best, especially for those with limited experience, but I haven't done one for almost 2 years :thumbs:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Arch is not overly complicated to install (If you can install Slack, you should be able to install Arch, too), but the documentation is definitely not top-notch imho, compared to other distros, thus you should know your way around in a linux system if you plan to install Arch. I guess that they are working on improving their documentation though.

I've always found their documentation to be quite good, via the wiki and the installation guide.

 

That being said, Arch Linux isn't for people who depend on a GUI - you have to be ready to delve right into the commandline.

 

They also have a pretty good description of their release cycle:

Arch Linux uses a "rolling release" system which works like this: We have two versions of our core package set at any given time, Current and Release. The Current repository always contains the latest and greatest versions of packages. As soon as a package is updated it is part of the Current repository, so this is the one to follow if you want to stay very up to date. The Release repository follows the semi-regular snapshot releases and does not update until the next snapshot/iso has been released. For example, the Release repository will point to all packages on the 0.5 ISO until we release 0.6; then it will point to 0.6 packages until 0.7 is released. This is useful if you only want to update your system when a new release is available.

From here. It actually gives you a choice between a rolling release and a point release, which is a great example of the Arch Linux mentality.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've been using the command line quite a bit lately, I don't mind. I started using PCs in 1985, bought an 8088 with no HD in 1985 for $3000. Only used DOS, never used win 3.1 till around 1990 or so, back then I prefered DOS. Wrote alot of batch files & stuff like that. Even after my employer started going to windows 3.1 machines, I still used DOS to do most things - I prefered it back then...

 

So, anyway, I realize now that 16 years of pointing & clicking has rotted my brain...

 

I like my mandriva machine, and it will be my main machine for awhile still. Its just that my win2k box is still a great machine, that is hardly being used anymore, other than for university assignments. Its got alot of "wasted" guts - 1GB RAM and 2 hard drives, totalling over 200GB. Might as well do the dual-boot thing and learn about rolling distros...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Its just that I've always read that the debian installer was not the easiest.

Seriously to try out Debian unstable/testing just install kanotix ....

Last install took me 12 mins from a liveCD to rebooting and perhaps 2 minutes before setting the user and root password.

Make sure you know your partitions before you start then you are confident its not overwriting one....

After install you have a fully functional system which is a pure Debian testing/unstable ...

 

All you really need to do after is install the nvidia or ati driver if you have these cards, run the network config tool and that's about it, you will have openoffice, amarok etc.

To install the questionable codecs etc. just click the #kanotix IRC button and just ask!

Paste what they tell you (its a bot) and its adds to your sources and installs the mutlimedia stuff....

 

edits: oops forgot ... The Debian netinstall isn't hard as such theproblem is you need to know what packages you want... I built a virgin pure Debian (in vmware) in perhaps 1 hour... including the download time with KDE and basic stuff. The reason I suggest kanotix is its a great way to learn this and then go back and build your own Debian ... you can even go all the way back to DFS and make your own installation CD etc. but I'd recommend starting off in kanotix because it saves a lot of frustration ... my first debian install took about 2 weeks ... lots of help from bvc and cybrjackle (here) and really had nothing that wasn't in the install I just did in a hour.. the only missing ingredient was my knowledge of the Debian packaging system....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I downloaded & burned the genioOS install CD (as artic suggested). Its supposed to be "pure debian".

 

Anyway, I haven't done anything yet. There's a couple things I'm worried about:

 

1. don't want to trash my win2k system

2. although I have 2 hard drives in the win2k box, I'm pretty sure they are both NTFS

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The things about the debian installer being difficult, are old and irrelevant now. You'll find most people who would say that, are referring to the installer at the time of debian woody.

 

More than 2 years ago now they started a newer installer intended for the release of Sarge, and it is quite capable, and not difficult to deal with at all unless you're a very green linux user, which you null, certainly arent, you've been around a while.

 

Don't waste time getting these 'pure' debian based distros, if they were pure, then they'd be plain debian. If you want 'pure' debian, download the installer and install it, it's not as difficult as it was once made out to be.

 

Rolling release based distros are the way to go imho. tyme described perfectly the Arch setup. If you want to be up to date, with a distro that is simple (KISS) and 'just works', Arch's the way to go.

 

James

Edited by iphitus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ok, I haven't done anything yet. Just d/l & burned the genieOS. I may d/l & burn debian sarge too, and also arch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The things about the debian installer being difficult, are old and irrelevant now. You'll find most people who would say that, are referring to the installer at the time of debian woody.

 

More than 2 years ago now they started a newer installer intended for the release of Sarge, and it is quite capable, and not difficult to deal with at all unless you're a very green linux user, which you null, certainly arent, you've been around a while.

 

Don't waste time getting these 'pure' debian based distros, if they were pure, then they'd be plain debian. If you want 'pure' debian, download the installer and install it, it's not as difficult as it was once made out to be.

 

Rolling release based distros are the way to go imho. tyme described perfectly the Arch setup. If you want to be up to date, with a distro that is simple (KISS) and 'just works', Arch's the way to go.

 

James

I pretty much agree .. the only reason i recommend kanotix is because its all installed with X working and everything.

I installed a base Debian stable the other day and it took me an hour ... to get it to the point of runing KDE. Im not saying Im an expert but I have experience with debian.

 

Indeed, I don't know why I installed Debian stable except for all the reasons you just stated! i had no reason except curiosity.

 

However, what I picked up from null is he just wants to try a rolling distro... my money is on if he tried kanotix giving it a go for a while then getting used to it and then doing exactly what I did ....installing pure Debian from scratch and my next project is DFS including making the install CD ... no reason except curiosity and I guess null will end up the same!

 

@null ...

I always use partition magic to repart NTFS .. Kanotix says it can do it .. I personally don't take the risk and leave it up to PM ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

×
×
  • Create New...