thekx Posted March 21, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 21, 2005 The Linux NIC and networking seem to be fine - look to the router The hub should be connected to the router through a normal socket, not the uplink socket, else it won't work. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hi again, and thanks for the quick reply. Really appreciate it! The router is a Linksys BEFW11S4. In addition to WiFi and a WAN uplink it has 4x 10/100 switched LAN ports. The hub is a Netgear DS106 with 6x internally-bridged 10/100 ports, one of which is switchable between 'normal' and 'uplink' position. To clarify, I'm connecting the 'uplink' port of the hub to one of the 4 LAN ports of the router, not to the router WAN uplink. Since the router ports are switched (I omitted to mention before - sorry, the implication didn't occur to me), I need to use the uplink rather than a normal hub port. You won't see anything with a packet sniffer on another machine if the router ports are switched - use the hub Ah, this surprises me. I'd have thought that I should see packets broadcast to 192.168.1.255 even among the switched ports. For instance, to allow me to run a dhcp server on a (working) linux box if I chose to disable the router's in-built dhcp. The router must be ignoring the Linux box - has it a setting to only allow certain MAC addresses perhaps?? Well, things are certainly starting to point to the router. Trouble is, the same router/NIC/wiring combination worked last week, and I didn't change the router settings in between. What can have changed when I did the mdk10.1 install, that stopped the NIC talking to the router? BIOS? MBR? Evil NIC probing which accidentally reflashes firmware?! It seems too much of a coincidence for it to work in the morning on 9.1 and fail in the afternoon on 10.1. N Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeter Posted March 21, 2005 Report Share Posted March 21, 2005 I go with the evil NIC theory :) I know what you mean, but strange coincidences do happen - I went to a customer that bought a new USB printer the other day and swore blind it made his PS2 keyboard go wrong - coincidence. An ordinary LAN socket on the router should be connected to an ordinary LAN socket on the hub for it to work. I notice in the manual that port 4 of the router becomes inactive if the uplink is used - worth checking... Running out of ideas - perhaps it might be worth resetting the router (after saving the settings) I'm off to bed now - my brain hurts. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thekx Posted March 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 22, 2005 An ordinary LAN socket on the router should be connected to an ordinary LAN socket on the hub for it to work. I notice in the manual that port 4 of the router becomes inactive if the uplink is used - worth checking... Running out of ideas - perhaps it might be worth resetting the router (after saving the settings) I'm off to bed now - my brain hurts. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Double-checked. I wondered if it would something really dumb like I'd got the wrong port in the router downstairs but no, the hub was in regular port 4, nothing in uplink. I tried the uplink instead (as the manual suggests this is where a hub should connect), and this completely killed the connection. I lost the link light until I switched the hub port back to normal mode - so it confirms that the router's 'uplink' port is just an unswitched connection - basically the Linksys uplink port is the only "ordinary LAN socket on the router" as you describe it above. Ports 1-4 are "out of the ordinary" because they're switched. I've factory-reset the router and run through the pings. Still nothing on linux, and still the odd additional behaviour where Windows equally fails to connect, if going through the hub. I can't help feeling this is a clue, but to what? I think I'm bailing for tonight too. Appreciate your help this far, Chris. Seems to confirm I have some sanity left. If anyone else has other ideas on what might be stopping my router talking to everything like it used to, I'd welcome it... G'night all, Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
streeter Posted March 22, 2005 Report Share Posted March 22, 2005 Good Morning! An ordinary LAN socket on the router should be connected to an ordinary LAN socket on the hub for it to work. Actually wrong - sorry tired... Don't worry too much about switched/non switched ports (as in network switching) these are ordinary LAN ports. The uplink ports are for daisy chaining hubs and switches together. A normal LAN port on the hub must be plugged into the uplink port on the router (or the other way round, it doesn't matter) with a normal straight through cable for this to work. All an uplink port does is simulate a crossover cable - this is why it usually disables the port next to it - it is in fact the same port with some wires reversed. router downstairs To eliminate the fixed cable running downstairs, position the router right next to the PCs. Unless you have a cable tester or it's only the windows machine upstairs (which works). The router doesn't need to be connected to the net to connect the 2 PCs. Probably shouldn't say it because you sound pretty clued up about networking, but I assume you set the IP address etc. on the router after the reset - the default is 192.168.1.1. Running out of ideas Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thekx Posted March 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 22, 2005 (edited) To eliminate the fixed cable running downstairs, position the router right next to the PCs. Unless you have a cable tester or it's only the windows machine upstairs (which works). The router doesn't need to be connected to the net to connect the 2 PCs. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well spotted! Unfortunately, I fear I can already eliminate the cable running downstairs, unless these are very heavy packets :P For both Windows and linux I've used the same two fixed CAT5 ports in the wall. I've wired the house with CAT5 as I've renovated it - it'll probably be obsolete within 10 years but should work now! Yesterday's efforts were with a 15m patch cord direct port-to-port just in case I managed to really screw up the patch panel wiring somewhere. So I don't think it's that. If I can I'll haul the router upstairs later and test out with shorter leads in case it's some wierd whole-house interference that offends only linux boxen. Probably shouldn't say it because you sound pretty clued up about networking, but I assume you set the IP address etc. on the router after the reset - the default is 192.168.1.1. Well, I guess I know a fair amount, but you never stop learning, and you can always completely forget the blindingly obvious! Router did default to ...1.1 which fits with the linux settings. Ta, Nick Edited March 22, 2005 by thekx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qchem Posted March 22, 2005 Report Share Posted March 22, 2005 Well, I guess I know a fair amount, but you never stop learning, and you can always completely forget the blindingly obvious! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> As we're moving into "obvious" territory, have you gone into mcc to check how the wizards etc think you're connected to the net - this may have been borked in the update. It's grabbing at straws but might be worth a look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thekx Posted March 22, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 22, 2005 (edited) Hi Qchem, MCC 'manage connections' reports: Device selected eth0: VIA Technologies|VT6102 [Rhine II 10/100] TCP/IP protocol static ip, netmask, gateway, dns all set correctly search domain none Options (yes) Start at boot (no) Track network card id (no) Network Hotplugging Metric 10 Information Vendor: VIA Technologies Description: VT6102 [Rhine II 10/100] Media class: NETWORK_ETHERNET Module name: via-rhine Mac Address: 0:40:***** Bus: PCI Location on the bus: - That's it. N Edited March 22, 2005 by thekx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qchem Posted March 23, 2005 Report Share Posted March 23, 2005 It's a long shot, but you could try going through the wizards to set up a LAN connection again. Upgrade installs can be a bit hit and miss and do occassionally break stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thekx Posted March 23, 2005 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2005 (edited) Unfortunately, as I posted (some time back now, I grant you!), I've actually gone through three full installs with format, keeping only the /home partition each time. I've been through the wizards several times before going back to bash where at least I know what's getting edited. :sad: N Edited March 23, 2005 by thekx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thekx Posted April 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 (edited) Well, after spending the best part of ten consecutive nights on this, I took some overdue family time before coming back to attack this problem fresh. First the good news - I managed to get the network working. Yay! The more puzzling news is that I can't work out exactly why... I brought the router upstairs, and found that I got different responses depending which LAN port I used. It seemed that ports 1, 2 and 3 worked with the linux box, but 4 wouldn't. When plugged in to any port, the link LEDs were showing a good 100Mb connection. The only difference was that on port 4, the activity LED was 'strobing' - flashing quickly. According to the manual, this is normal response for a busy port. Whilst it may be doing something it just isn't exchanging packets. I figured maybe it was just a weird port failure on that one socket on the router. I thought it seemed odd that I hadn't noticed it before in all my other swapping of leads, but never mind. So, I moved the router back downstairs, and reconnected the same patch cables through a 'good' port. Guess what - once again I was seeing the activity LED strobing, and no network via the linux box. Switch port or cable again, and it works. Savage. So, I've found a combination of port and cable which works, and it's been stable for a couple of days. In summary, it doesn't actually seem to be consistently specific to any port or any patch cable. The combinations which don't work on the linux box do work on the Windows box. The only consistent thing is the combination of router and NIC hardware. The most frustrating thing is that the router LEDs suggested that it's a good, active connection at a hardware level; but this now looks bogus. In truth I guess I must have just positioned the box with bad feng shui when I loaded up the DVD to install mdk10.1. Now it does talk to the router, everything seems to work really smoothly, thanks to all the advice here! I think I'll work on the basis of 'let it be' and consider a router upgrade in the longer term. Thanks to all who have offered suggestions, especially streeter. You guys are gurus. If a mod wants to mark this thread solved, that's fine by me - I can't see any way to edit the title as a regular punter. Best, Nick Edited April 2, 2005 by thekx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spinynorman Posted April 2, 2005 Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 If a mod wants to mark this thread solved, that's fine by me - I can't see any way to edit the title as a regular punter. You just edit the first post in the thread. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thekx Posted April 2, 2005 Author Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 (edited) You just edit the first post in the thread. ;) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Sneaky! :P Didn't see this in the Help section FAQ - maybe worth adding under the 'posting' or 'topics' heading? N Edited April 2, 2005 by thekx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spinynorman Posted April 2, 2005 Report Share Posted April 2, 2005 Sneaky! :P Didn't see this in the Help section FAQ - maybe worth adding under the 'posting' or 'topics' heading? We didn't want it to be too obvious, so it's hidden in Forum Discussion. :P I've now included the instruction in the Practical Posting Guidelines. I'll speak to the other mods about updating the Help facility as there are other things wrong with it. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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