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Arch Linux: First Impressions


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I have a 'Toy Machine' in my loft now (no, not a skateboard, a computer). It gets used as a server... sometimes and as my girlfriend's box most of the time, but its real purpose is for me to try out new distros.:P

 

So I decided to load Arch Linux on it yesterday. Anybody who chats on #musb will have noticed that Gentoo vs. Arch is a regular discussion and the Arch users show off a lot while us Gentoo users just sit back in silent confidence :cheeky::lol2:

 

Arch Linux is a Linux distribution which is compiled for i686 (Pentium II and above) making it faster then i386 or i586 distributions. It uses a Package manager called Pacman and is designed to be a lightweight and highly stable distribution that is easy and straightforward to use.

 

Anyway, I decided to try it out and see what all the hype was about.

 

Installation went smoothly, it is clearly not aimed at n00bs, but is simpler to install than Debian... or Gentoo. I do not like cfdisk, which is used by default to partition disks, but it isn't the end of the world. Liked the fact that it tackled all the major configuration files at installation. Didn't like the package selection tool - a whole list of packages and a little frustrating to get through.

 

Installation summary: Very easy if you know what you're doing and a generally pleasant experience, although I found installing Gentoo more interesting and for easy installations I prefer the Mandrake approach. Just me.

 

Onto the package manager now; I love the name Pacman - nice. I also tried man pacman, which gave me the man page for the pacman xscreensaver. :cheesy: What irritated me was that I couldn't install packages from the cd without doing a --refresh first. I did add the cd as the first source to examine, but without a refresh, no go. So: don't try this without an Internet connection.

 

Other than that Pacman works great and you can also make your own packages for it very quickly and easily. It is a lot faster to install things using Pacman's approach than Portage. It would be closer to Apt in functionality.

 

Package Manager summary: Pacman is cool, although I prefer using Portage. Apt is also IMHO a better Package manager, although Pacman is better than urpmi and easier to maintain.

 

The general workings of Arch are pretty standard and I found it to be very lightweight (I like that) and highly stable. It took a while to get used to the /dev differences (/dev/hda1 on most distros = /dev/disc0/part1 or something like that on Arch). The whole /dev thing didn't make much sense to me, but whatever. It was easy to get XFree and Gnome up and running and I had no problems compiling a 2.6.6 vanilla kernel or installing the nvidia drivers.

 

Overall Impressions: Arch Linux rocks. If you are used to Mandrake and would like to move onto something more challenging, Arch would be a good next step before moving onto Debian, LFS or Gentoo. I still prefer Gentoo though as I think Portage is a better Package Manager - I like installing from source (the time doesn't bother me) and the support is a little better (much more people on the forums).

 

So, is it a good distro? Definately! Will it replace Gentoo on my main machine? Nope! - that honour is reserved for Slackware or Debian :cheesy:

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(I'm sure you knew I was going to be the first to reply! iphitus should stop in soon too ;) )

 

It took a while to get used to the /dev differences (/dev/hda1 on most distros = /dev/disc0/part1 or something like that on Arch). The whole /dev thing didn't make much sense to me, but whatever.

sometime you should check out what /dev/hdxx points to ;) arch just isn't giving you that extra link. I like arch's way better, because it kind of seperates things out to a better organization instead of having a ton of hdxx's sitting in /dev, but that's just MHO.

 

I still prefer Gentoo though as I think Portage is a better Package Manager - I like installing from source (the time doesn't bother me) and the support is a little better (much more people on the forums).

 

So, is it a good distro? Definately! Will it replace Gentoo on my main machine? Nope! - that honour is reserved for Slackware or Debian :cheesy:

keep in mind arch has yet to hit a 1.0 release, and is much younger than these last 2 distro's. Gentoo released 1.0 a month before Arch's 0.1...it's still got some growing pains to go through. What I do like is the fact that they haven't hit 1.0, because - having used it for some time - if this isn't a completed distribution, I can't wait to see what 1.0 is like!

 

I'm not sure why you think portage is better than pacman...i've never had any troubles with pacman. I even pushed a few new features for it (specifically, grouping things so you can do "pacman gnome" instead of having to do it all seperately). Heck, if you do pacman gnome and see some stuff you don't want, just answer "no" to the question "do you want to install all these?" and you can go through one-at-a-time and tell it whether or not to install that package. Sure, this takes a little more knowledge on the part of the user, but arch is not intended to be completely user-friendly, it's more designed to make things a little easier for the advanced user. atleast, that's how i felt about it.

 

anyways, I'm glad someone has tried arch again. I've been keeping an eye on it, and waiting for 0.7 which may mark my return...currently I'm playing with gentoo. My biggest complaint about Arch is that it needs a larger number of software packages - but that's improving.

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Brother Tyme, everything you say is true.

 

You are right about the /dev thing, it's just a case of being different from what I am used to. Not bad, just different ;)

 

I like Portage, because I am used it mostly, but also because I like the compiling thing (must be just me:P ) Anyway, I DIDN'T say Pacman was bad, just that I PREFER Portage. Once I am used to Pacman I'm sure it will grow on me, but for now - gimme Portage.

 

I also find searching for packages easier and more comprehensively done with Portage. Also, as you said, just being able to do a 'emerge gnome' is so simple and convenient. Pacman provides you with more control over the process, but you can have just as much control with Portage if you do emerge -up and then choose the packages you need yourself.

 

I also realise that Arch is young and has a long way to go. Please don't get me wrong - I like Arch... alot, I just still prefer Gentoo ;)

 

That's just me and I suppose it has a lot to do with what I am used to - Gentoo is home for me at the moment, I have been using it for a while and I am comfortable with it. That doesn't make it better for everyone, just better for me :cheesy:

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I think a bigger diff in portage & packman is you can get more specific of what you want in the package with portage. I didn't find ABS to work all that great in arch. It is a decent distro, but I don't get the feeling they have much direction.

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That doesn't make it better for everyone, just better for me :cheesy:

That's what Linux is all about, Bother SoulSe! (oh, and it's a small t in tyme :P )

 

I think a bigger diff in portage & packman is you can get more specific of what you want in the package with portage. I didn't find ABS to work all that great in arch.

of course you can get specific about what you want with portage, it's meant to be that way. pacman doesn't have the goal of you being able to build every package, including and excluding what you want - it's meant to be more basic, slimmed down, but still full-functional. ABS is not the main focus of arch - it's not intended to be like emerge/portage. Arch is intended to be more like slackware, so comparing it to gentoo is a bit unfair ;)

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(I'm sure you knew I was going to be the first to reply! iphitus should stop in soon too ;) )

yo!

 

im just back from a holiday in tasmania, was fun, went to the cadbury factory, port arthur and all around tasmania.

 

The different /dev/ really confused me a little at first too. I had them all written on paper, the hdx and /dev/disc.... form. But it isnt so bad.

 

I havnt got much to say really, tyme covered a lot. i like Arch more than debian. The only down I have had is that there are less packages in pacman, but it isnt so bad, because Arch includes the development libraries when you install gtk or any library, I havent had a problem compiling anything. Most things I have compiled are more obscure things anyway.

 

And like tyme said, Arch is only at 0.6, whereas Debian is well over 3.

 

iphitus

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I wasn't comparing Gentoo to Arch because they are similar - only because I now use Gentoo and they are two of the more interesting/young distros out there.

 

I think that Arch does have direction, but it just hasn't taken off in the way that Gentoo has _yet_ - more interest = more developers = better distro.

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  • 4 weeks later...
arch has already converted to supporting udev with basically a drop in package. you can run a 2.6 or 2.4 kernel they are working on getting nptl support in as soon as it is more stable.

:unsure:

wait....working on nptl for when it is more stable, but have already converted to alpha code/udev? What's the drop in pkg? Does everything related to udev actually work for 95% of the users?

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udev is stable and functional for most people that use it. there are some problems here and there but they are very very minor at this point. the package is called udev and with a few current initscript package changes allows udev to drop right in.

 

in my opinion though i kind of prefer devfs. i don't see the advantages one the surface. admittingly though i have not read up on the differences.

 

ntpl is not used yet because arch still has a fair number of 2.4 kernel users and it does not support ntpl.

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I really like Arch. I've tried it several times and now am settled with it. Mu only complaint is that the community built around it (in my experience) can be a little bit elitist and not very helpful - not always I've had some great help form some of the guys on their forum, but often "archers" seem to not actually want anyone else to use their distro so that can keep it small and how they like it - I don't know why, insecurity maybe ;)

 

Edit: as you can see from my sig - I much prefer using arch to gentoo. For far too many reason than I can be bothered to list right now...g

Edited by phunni
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I like Arch a lot. Updated packages usually make it to the pacman servers in hours after they are released. Not the best if you are looking for stability, but it is if you are looking for the newest stuff.

 

I have been using udev w/o problem since the 030-4 release. Very easy to change over. Just update initscripts and then add a line to your boot loaer to turn off devfs.

 

I think some arch people come off a bit off sometimes because the distro itself is not really aimed at total newbies, or is it advertised at them, but inevitable some try (which is great). Then some of the more experienced users can be a bit short in their replies to the newbies. A nicely worded intelligent question issuued after a search of the forum is never shot down (well, maybe by one of the frequent posters...).

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