Bill Lewis

KKn, If you still monitor this board check this out. Had the same problem as I use anywhere between 16 and 50 pty's simultaneously. The tty:s problem is a configuration FU with pty's. I had the same problem and fixed it by modifying /etc/udev/rules.d/50-mdk.rules. Change the following 2 lines: KERNEL=="tty[p-za-e][0-9a-f]*", NAME="pty/s%n", SYMLINK+="%k", GROUP="tty", OPTIONS="last_rule" KERNEL=="pty[p-za-e][0-9a-f]*", NAME="pty/m%n", SYMLINK+="%k", GROUP="tty", OPTIONS="last_rule" To this: KERNEL=="pty[pqrstuvwxyzabcdef][0123456789abcdef]", NAME="%k", GROUP="tty", MODE="666", OPTIONS="last_rule" KERNEL=="tty[pqrstuvwxyzabcdef][0123456789abcdef]", NAME="%k", GROUP="tty", MODE="666", OPTIONS="last_rule" The 2006 install creates 256 symlinks to 11 actual pty devices which is bullshit. If you make the change you will get 256 actual pty devices as on every other linux distro that I have ever seen(going back to '94). Someone at Mandriva needs to pull his head out of his butt. -bill

Google "Practical Data Structures in C++" and you'll find plenty on the subject.

Steve, Yeah, it's really strange. Obviously your box is not using the contents of that file to configure your pty's. I was starting to dig into the how the pty's are configured in the kernel when Patrick tipped me off to the 50-mdk.rules file. My kernel is configured to use Unix98 pty support(used pseudo term multiplexing) AND legacy pty support(which is what your box, and my now working box, are using). There is some good info on pty's in /usr/src/linux/Documentation/devices.txt. I found some weird kernel config issues where the Unix98 pty support is tied to the CONFIG_EMBEDDED var in the .config file which is enabled in the boxed Mandriva distro. This is pretty scary as there is warning in xconfig for CONFIG_EMBEDDED and it's not something that's enabled in another 2.16 distro that I am screwing around with. I decided that, for right now, I don't give a shit about how it really works as the change I made fixes my problem and I now need to install Mandriva 2006 PowerPack on 2 of my other machines. Might get back to it later. Let me know if you figure it out. LOL. -bill

Old topic, new Mandriva user, Here's my $.02, Been using redhat distros since '94. My MOis, install, grep /etc for all "redhat" instances and remove, build stripped down kernel and boot floppy, then have smug feeling that I'm on my own distro. Install were always a breeze, CD's always have the same handy stuff that I use day to day. In the last month I have tried Ubuntu(Breezy Badger), SuSe 10.0 and Mandriva PowerPack on both a desktop(IBM Netvista) and laptop(Thinkpad T43). All three distros intalled easily on both. My impressions are: Ubuntu, worst of the 3 distros, not worth the price or effort. Only one of the installs that didn't get the wireless working on the laptop. Also, I couldn't use any of the gnome administration tools because it would never accept the root password. WTF ! The biggest drawback is that you have to adapt to the Debian way of doing things which is a quite a bit different than other distros I'm used to. Not that the Debian way is bad, but in the case of Ubuntu, the distro didn't come with much in the way of packages and I really didn't have the patience to have to try to download package after package to get things working which worked after install on the other distros. The most flagrant example of this was when I went to build a kernel. Doing a simple "make xconfig" spewed out all sorts of errors about things missing. That's when I figured enough was enough. SuSe, lowly second of the 3 distros, OK onlyif you're a newbie and don't want, or need, to "have it your way". You need to be root to do anything, their configuration scripts are a bizarre collection of garbage meant to obfuscate the way you would normally configure anything on a linux box. They have totally botched basic things like file permissions, pppd, etc. to the point where if you want to do it your way you will need to spent an enormous amount of time de-f**king their scripts. Their installation support is non-existent. I tried opening several email tickets and they all came back with "not covered under the terms" bullshit. So I figure f**k them, I'm on an anti-Suse crusade from here on. Mandriva, best of the 3 distros. They totally messed up the pty configuration but that probably affects .01% of the people that use it(me being one of them). Upside is that I got the direction I needed to fix it on this site. Other little annoyance is that the distro doesn't come with an ftp daemon, and some things didn't install by default(i.e. xterm). These are easily fixed. Everything else is very familiar to this old-school linux user so I definitely give Mandriva the nod of the 3 distros that I've been evaluating. Hope this is of some help. BTW: excuse my profanity in the above but those SuSe morons don't deserve any better :-)

Steve, That's how it's supposed to look. Powerpack install just ain't the same. Patrick You win. /etc/udev/rules.d/50-mdk.rules is the file that controls the pty config. I'm not really famiilar with udev but, with a basic understanding of pseudo terminals, it took all of one minute to edit the file so the system configures 256 actual devices. this gets changed: KERNEL=="tty[p-za-e][0-9a-f]*", NAME="pty/s%n", SYMLINK+="%k", GROUP="tty", OPTIONS="last_rule" KERNEL=="pty[p-za-e][0-9a-f]*", NAME="pty/m%n", SYMLINK+="%k", GROUP="tty", OPTIONS="last_rule" to this: KERNEL=="pty[pqrstuvwxyzabcdef][0123456789abcdef]", NAME="%k", GROUP="tty", MODE="666", OPTIONS="last_rule" KERNEL=="tty[pqrstuvwxyzabcdef][0123456789abcdef]", NAME="%k", GROUP="tty", MODE="666", OPTIONS="last_rule" BTW: didn't mean to slam this site in any way. Matter of fact I'll be hanging around it now that it looks like the place where the most knowledgeable people seem to be hanging out. I did a few posts on the mandriva expert site and didn't get any response at all. I'll definitely be making an issue of this pty config on the main Mandriva site. Doubt I'm the first to run into this, but maybe the first one to surface on this site. One reason I can think of is that I don't use the 'xterm' from xorg which doesn't seem to use pty's. If I did use it there wouldn't be an issue. Unfortunately that client has the most pathetic scrolling mechanism/appearance I have ever seen, and I was programming X/Motif as far back as the '80's. I've been using MetroLink Motif 'mxterm'(uses pty's) for as long as it's been in existence and up until this install I have always used their Motif window manager. Just starting to use KDE now that there happen to be a few good KDE apps available. Guess there just aren't that many old-school unix developers left anymore. We will always be a problem. Anyway, THANKS again for providing the answer I have been looking for. -bill

Thanks for taking a look. I've already wasted a shitload of time grepping the shit out of rc and etc dirs with no luck. It's not a security issue as I don't even have a firewall installed. My system contains 256 tty/pty pairs configured in dev but they are symbolic links to 11 "physical" tty/pty pairs in /dev/pty: lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp0 -> pty/s0 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp1 -> pty/s1 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp2 -> pty/s2 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp3 -> pty/s3 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp4 -> pty/s4 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp5 -> pty/s5 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp6 -> pty/s6 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp7 -> pty/s7 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp8 -> pty/s8 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Feb 26 07:02 ttyp9 -> pty/s9 lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 5 Feb 26 07:02 ttypa -> pty/s lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 5 Feb 26 07:02 ttypb -> pty/s lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 5 Feb 26 07:02 ttypc -> pty/s lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 5 Feb 26 07:02 ttypd -> pty/s lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 5 Feb 26 07:02 ttype -> pty/s lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 5 Feb 26 07:02 ttypf -> pty/s there are 15 other tty'x' configurations just like this. As soon as I have 11 mxterms running I start to get "no available pty's". I've added more in rc.local along with the necessary symbolic links to access the new devices but the kernel does not seem to recognize them and I'm still restricted to 11 pty's. As I somtimes use as many as 40 pty's simultaneously while working, Mandriva is currently a huge failure in my book. Might be some real flaming in the works if Mandriva doesn't step up and provide an answer. Checked 3 other distro's I've still have sitting around on other machines and all of them have 256 actual tty/pty pairs at installation. As I said previously, someone at Mandriva needs to have his head pulled out of his ass. This is just the kind of BS that continues to assure that Linux stays out of the mainstream. Thanx again. -bill

That is my last resort. I more interested in finding out where, in the system boot sequence, this is done and make the change there. The way Mandriva configures it is bullshit. Every other distro I've looked at provides 256 actual pty's, not 256 links to 10 pty's/. Whoever decided that 10 pty's was enough needs to have his head pulled out of his butt.

Thanks for the well-informed advice. Although I've been running on Linux for 12 years, I guess I'm just a Mandriva newbie:-) I've already kind of figured out about trying to rpm from another distro. Kind of sucks that different distros keep redoing rpm(and other stuff) so it's not compatible all around. I think this behavior by the various vendors contributes to why linux is still out of the mainstream. Nice to have choices, but when compatibility is compromised, is it really worth it? The urpmi stuff is totally new to me but looks like it's pretty straightforward to use. I'm sure I'll get familiar with it as I look for an ftp daemon. Thanks again. -bill

Here's my $.02 I'm in the same boat as the "longtime FC" guy. I've been using redhat distros since about '94 and never had any issues like I have now with Mandriva. I've always bashed redhat because I think they believe they owned linux, and also tried to force gnome on everyone. After installing redhat the first thing I would do was to grep through /etc for "redhat" and then delete/change any references. Then I'd build the latest kernel, and feel like I had my own distro. I'd buy the redhat distros just because they always installed well and contained lots of packages for utils that I use. The time I saved was worth the price of the distro and in the end I guess I have been satisfied with the product, if not the company. I've had Mandriva PowerPack 2006 installed for about 3 days now and have a couple of weird problems that I've never had before. Both are distro related and I'm pretty pissed off because they are stupid things that just shouldn't exist. The first problem is that the installed config is limited to just 10 pty's which is a joke(redhat, suse have 256). I've tried a few things I know about char devices to remedy the problem but the correction is wiped out on each reboot. I've posted on another forum but have yet to find the answer. The second problem is that the distro doesn't have an ftp daemon. What kind of bs is that? I'm sure I'll get to the bottom of this shit soon but the time I've wasted is pissing me off. I've tried Kubuntu, nice install, but the distro doesn't contain much and unless you are familiar with the Debian way of doing things you may get pretty frustrated having to search for and download many, many packages.

Neither one is on the PowerPack 2006 DVD. During the install I checked the box for proftp but it didn't work. I looked in the rpm directories and tried the software installer tool and didn't come up with any ftp servers, just clients. I tried to install the vsftp rpm from a suse 10.0 DVD and got a dependency issue for inet-daemon(even though I have xinetd installed and running). I then forced it in with --nodeps but I got weird error messages when trying to connect from other machines. I configured vsftpd in xinetd.d just as I have on both of my other linux boxes so I'm familiar with how its done. Is there a Mandriva ftp site where I can get proftp or vsftpd.?

Steve, I installed Mandriva 2006 Powerpack. /proc/sys/kernel/pty/max is 4096, but there are only 10 pty devices configured. I checked my other 2 machines(redhat, suse) and both of them have 256 devices configured. Looks like Mandriva has 256 links in /dev to 10 configured pty devices in /dev/pty. This appears to be the problem because I can only get 10 xterms to work simultaneously. I used 'mknod' to create additional devices and then changed some of the duplicated links to point to them, but these all disappear after a reboot. Seems like it's some kind of configuration issue. I looked in rc.sysinit but couldn't really find anything that is related to the problem. Any other ideas welcome. thanx. -bill

Am I blind or did Mandriva just forget to add an ftp daemon to the Powerpak installation media?

Anyone know how to increase the number of pty's the system has available? I just did an install and found that some of my scripts that fire up 10 or more xterms do not execute because after several xterms appear the shell starts spewing "no available ptys". I've never seen that on any distro before.

Just finished installing 2006 PowerPack DVD on one of my machines and found that I can't access any network services(ping, telnet, ssh, ftp) on any machine on my local subnet. The really weird thing is that the other machines can access services(ping, ssh) on the machine that I just did the install on. The output from 'route' looks normal and I verified that the packets are going out on the local subnet but not getting to the destination machine(i.e. watched the led's on the hub). Been installing linux distros since 1994 and never had a network problem until now. Any ideas what Mandriva is doing under the covers?